{"id":35603,"date":"2015-07-06T12:36:43","date_gmt":"2015-07-06T16:36:43","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/?p=35603"},"modified":"2016-03-22T20:15:44","modified_gmt":"2016-03-23T00:15:44","slug":"podcast-94-review-of-seeking-allah-finding-jesus-part-2","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-94-review-of-seeking-allah-finding-jesus-part-2\/","title":{"rendered":"podcast 94 \u2013 review of Seeking Allah, Finding Jesus \u2013 Part 2"},"content":{"rendered":"<div class=\"powerpress_player\" id=\"powerpress_player_6919\"><audio class=\"wp-audio-shortcode\" id=\"audio-35603-1\" preload=\"none\" style=\"width: 100%;\" controls=\"controls\"><source type=\"audio\/mpeg\" src=\"http:\/\/media.blubrry.com\/trinities\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/podcast\/trinities094.mp3?_=1\" \/><a href=\"http:\/\/media.blubrry.com\/trinities\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/podcast\/trinities094.mp3\">http:\/\/media.blubrry.com\/trinities\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/podcast\/trinities094.mp3<\/a><\/audio><\/div><p class=\"powerpress_links powerpress_links_mp3\" style=\"margin-bottom: 1px !important;\">Podcast: <a href=\"http:\/\/media.blubrry.com\/trinities\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/podcast\/trinities094.mp3\" class=\"powerpress_link_pinw\" target=\"_blank\" title=\"Play in new window\" onclick=\"return powerpress_pinw('https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/?powerpress_pinw=35603-podcast');\" rel=\"nofollow\">Play in new window<\/a> | <a href=\"http:\/\/media.blubrry.com\/trinities\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/podcast\/trinities094.mp3\" class=\"powerpress_link_d\" title=\"Download\" rel=\"nofollow\" download=\"trinities094.mp3\">Download<\/a><\/p><p class=\"powerpress_links powerpress_subscribe_links\">Subscribe: <a href=\"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/7FuUF9DZM3zhtN41n6RJ6l\" class=\"powerpress_link_subscribe powerpress_link_subscribe_spotify\" target=\"_blank\" title=\"Subscribe on Spotify\" rel=\"nofollow\">Spotify<\/a> | <a href=\"https:\/\/subscribebyemail.com\/trinities.org\/blog\/feed\/podcast\/\" class=\"powerpress_link_subscribe powerpress_link_subscribe_email\" target=\"_blank\" title=\"Subscribe by Email\" rel=\"nofollow\">Email<\/a> | <a href=\"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/feed\/podcast\/\" class=\"powerpress_link_subscribe powerpress_link_subscribe_rss\" target=\"_blank\" title=\"Subscribe via RSS\" rel=\"nofollow\">RSS<\/a><\/p><p><a href=\"http:\/\/science.uvu.edu\/ochem\/index.php\/alphabetical\/q-r\/resonance-theory\/\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"alignright wp-image-35605 size-full\" src=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/Nitrate-ion-charts.png\" alt=\"Nitrate ion charts\" width=\"400\" height=\"334\" srcset=\"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/Nitrate-ion-charts.png 400w, https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/Nitrate-ion-charts-300x251.png 300w, https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/Nitrate-ion-charts-90x75.png 90w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 400px) 100vw, 400px\" \/><\/a><strong>Trinitarian theologies\u00a0are a major barrier to Muslims<\/strong> accepting\u00a0Christianity. In this episode (<a href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-93-review-of-seeking-allah-finding-jesus-part-1\/\" target=\"_blank\">part 1<\/a>) we hear how Mr. Qureshi changed his view that the Trinity\u00a0is a patently ridiculous doctrine. Issues discussed include:<\/p>\n<ul>\n<li>How his <strong>science<\/strong> education played a role in this, specifically models of the nitrate ion, shown here.<\/li>\n<li>Is the Trinity\u00a0inconsistent with <strong>Tawhid<\/strong> &#8211; with the Islamic teaching of monotheism\/oneness? If so, exactly <em>how<\/em> are these inconsistent?<\/li>\n<li>And just what is <strong>&#8220;the&#8221; Trinity doctrine<\/strong>? The words are easy to say: &#8220;three <em>hypostases\u00a0<\/em>in one <em>ousia,<\/em>&#8221; but there is disagreement about what they mean. Is it enough to simply repeat words, such as &#8220;three Persons in one essence&#8221;?<\/li>\n<li>Do Christians and Muslims worship the<strong> same god<\/strong>?<\/li>\n<li>Do Muslims, on the whole, rely too much on <strong>religious authorities<\/strong>, irresponsibly declining to think through important theological matters for themselves?<\/li>\n<li>Does Mr. Qureshi, when it comes to the Trinity and Incarnation, rely too much on Christian authorities, and on popular evangelical assumptions?<\/li>\n<li>Is<strong> the Trinity an <em>essential<\/em> Christian belief<\/strong>, i.e. a belief without which a person is not a Christian?<\/li>\n<li><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"alignleft wp-image-35635 size-full\" src=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/Silesia_Throne_of_Grace.jpg\" alt=\"Silesia_Throne_of_Grace\" width=\"314\" height=\"479\" srcset=\"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/Silesia_Throne_of_Grace.jpg 314w, https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/Silesia_Throne_of_Grace-197x300.jpg 197w, https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/Silesia_Throne_of_Grace-90x137.jpg 90w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 314px) 100vw, 314px\" \/>Is it <strong>blasphemous\u00a0to worship any man?<\/strong> Is it blasphemous to worship anyone\u00a0other than the one God? Does the New Testament agree with the Qur&#8217;an about these questions?<\/li>\n<li>Is the only conceivable good reason to worship Jesus the view that Jesus is God himself? Is this <strong>why the earliest Christians worshiped Jesus<\/strong>?<\/li>\n<li>To be a valid <strong>sacrifice<\/strong> for human sin, did Jesus have to be God, or to have infinite value?<\/li>\n<li>Does Christianity teach that <strong>God himself died on the cross<\/strong> for your sins?<\/li>\n<li>Is the &#8220;one like a son of man&#8221; in Daniel 7 &#8220;a divine figure&#8221; in the sense of being one &#8220;Person&#8221; within the one God?<\/li>\n<li>Does the Bible teach that Jesus is God&#8230; and also that he isn&#8217;t God?<\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<p>You can also <strong>listen t<\/strong><strong>o this episode on<\/strong>\u00a0<strong><a title=\"trinities podcast @ stitcher\" href=\"http:\/\/www.stitcher.com\/s?fid=54067&amp;refid=stpr\" target=\"_blank\">Stitcher<\/a><\/strong>\u00a0or\u00a0<strong><a title=\"trinities @ itunes\" href=\"https:\/\/itunes.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/id690304581?mt=2&amp;uo=4&amp;at=11l5XS\" target=\"_blank\">iTunes<\/a>\u00a0(please subscribe, rate, and review<\/strong>\u00a0us in either or both \u2013 <strong><a title=\"how to rate us at iTunes and Stitcher\" href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/review\/\" target=\"_blank\">directions here<\/a><\/strong>). It is also available on<a title=\"trinities podcast youtube playlist\" href=\"https:\/\/www.youtube.com\/playlist?list=PLMCt15e8gG-g7t7wo9MCq9KSDSsvGNcsm\" target=\"_blank\">Youtube <\/a>(scroll down \u2013 you can\u00a0<a title=\"youtube subscription link\" href=\"http:\/\/www.youtube.com\/user\/khanpadawan?sub_confirmation=1\" target=\"_blank\">subscribe here<\/a>). If you would like to\u00a0<strong>upload audio feedback<\/strong> for possible inclusion in a future episode of this podcast,\u00a0<a title=\"upload audio feedback for the trinities podcast here\" href=\"http:\/\/www.mediafire.com\/filedrop\/filedrop_hosted.php?drop=96df5ea43b9b7c6582cb95b8c5a7259d7cd8109e0cd009d4a5ecd099cc7e64fb\" target=\"_blank\">put the audio file here<\/a>.<\/p>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/astore.amazon.com\/trinities-20\/detail\/0310515025\" target=\"_blank\"><strong><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\" size-full wp-image-35606 alignright\" src=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/Qureshi-Seeking-Allah-Finding-Jesus-smaller.jpg\" alt=\"Qureshi - Seeking Allah, Finding Jesus smaller\" width=\"250\" height=\"382\" srcset=\"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/Qureshi-Seeking-Allah-Finding-Jesus-smaller.jpg 250w, https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/Qureshi-Seeking-Allah-Finding-Jesus-smaller-196x300.jpg 196w, https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/Qureshi-Seeking-Allah-Finding-Jesus-smaller-90x138.jpg 90w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 250px) 100vw, 250px\" \/><\/strong><\/a><strong>Links for this episode<\/strong><\/p>\n<ul>\n<li><strong><a href=\"http:\/\/rzim.org\/bio\/nabeel-qureshi\" target=\"_blank\">Mr. Nabeel Qureshi<\/a><\/strong>\n<ul>\n<li><strong><a href=\"http:\/\/astore.amazon.com\/trinities-20\/detail\/0310515025\" target=\"_blank\"><em>Seeking Allah, Finding Jesus<\/em><\/a> (<a href=\"http:\/\/astore.amazon.com\/trinities-20\/detail\/B00DL18FMU\" target=\"_blank\">kindle<\/a>)<\/strong><\/li>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/www.youtube.com\/watch?v=Mcir0LI_TXE\" target=\"_blank\">his debate with\u00a0Sulaiman Hashim &#8220;Who is Jesus?&#8221;<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/www.youtube.com\/user\/Creed26Ministries\" target=\"_blank\">his youtube channel<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/en.wikipedia.org\/wiki\/Joseph_Smith\" target=\"_blank\">@twitter<\/a><\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<\/li>\n<li><a href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-93-review-of-seeking-allah-finding-jesus-part-1\/\" target=\"_blank\">podcast 93 \u2013 review of <em>Seeking Allah, Finding Jesus<\/em> \u2013 Part 1<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-episode-51-dr-ravi-zacharias-on-the-trinity\/\" target=\"_blank\">podcast 51 \u2013 Dr. Ravi Zacharias on the Trinity<\/a><\/li>\n<li><strong><a href=\"http:\/\/science.uvu.edu\/ochem\/index.php\/alphabetical\/q-r\/resonance-theory\/\" target=\"_blank\">Resonance theory &#8211; on Lewis diagrams for the nitrate ion<\/a><\/strong><\/li>\n<li><a href=\"http:\/\/plato.stanford.edu\/entries\/divine-simplicity\/\" target=\"_blank\">divine simplicity<\/a><\/li>\n<li>posts on <a href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/?s=islam-inspired\" target=\"_blank\">&#8220;Islam-inspired modalism&#8221;<\/a> (i.e. trinitarians defending the Trinity in a one-self way to Muslims)<\/li>\n<li><a href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/identity\/\" target=\"_blank\">identity (numerical sameness)<\/a> (<a href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/on-numerical-sameness-identity-absolute-identity\/\" target=\"_blank\">advanced<\/a>)<\/li>\n<li><a href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/10-steps-towards-getting-less-confused-about-the-trinity-9-formulas-vs-interpretations\/\" target=\"_blank\">10 steps towards getting less confused about the Trinity \u2013 #9 \u2013 Formulas vs. Interpretations<\/a><\/li>\n<li><strong>&#8220;Trinity&#8221; &#8211; some entries which are required reading<\/strong> for people trying to think through the Trinity traditions, to go beyond\u00a0merely repeating\u00a0standard formulas\n<ul>\n<li><a href=\"http:\/\/plato.stanford.edu\/entries\/trinity\/\" target=\"_blank\">@ The Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy<\/a> (Tuggy) (<a href=\"http:\/\/www.lulu.com\/shop\/dale-tuggy\/trinity\/paperback\/product-21291220.html\" target=\"_blank\">book<\/a>)<\/li>\n<li><a href=\"http:\/\/www.iep.utm.edu\/trinity\/\" target=\"_blank\">@ The Internet Encyclopedia of Philosophy<\/a> (Baber)<\/li>\n<li><a href=\"http:\/\/www.faculty.wwu.edu\/howardd\/Trinity.pdf\" target=\"_blank\">@ The Routledge Encyclopedia of Philosophy<\/a> (Howard-Snyder)<\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<\/li>\n<li><strong><a href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/larry-hurtado-on-early-christians-worship-of-jesus\/\" target=\"_blank\">Dr. Larry Hurtado on early Christians&#8217; worship of Jesus<\/a><\/strong>\n<ul>\n<li>&#8220;<a href=\"http:\/\/evangelicaltextualcriticism.blogspot.com\/2011\/10\/how-on-earth-did-larry-hurtado-become.html\" target=\"_blank\">How on Earth Did Larry Hurtado Become a Text-Critic?&#8221;<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/hurtado-on-the-worship-of-jesus\/\" target=\"_blank\">Hurtado on the early worship of Jesus<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/evangelical-apologists-take-note-hurtado-on-jesus-and-god\/\" target=\"_blank\">evangelical apologists take note: Hurtado on Jesus and God<\/a><\/li>\n<li><em><a href=\"http:\/\/astore.amazon.com\/trinities-20\/detail\/0802828612\" target=\"_blank\">How on Earth Did Jesus Become a God?<\/a><\/em> (<a href=\"http:\/\/astore.amazon.com\/trinities-20\/detail\/B001QOGJ9K\" target=\"_blank\">kindle<\/a>)<\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<\/li>\n<li><strong>atonement theories<\/strong>\n<ul>\n<li><a href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-91-dr-joshua-thurow-on-theories-of-the-atonement\/\" target=\"_blank\">podcast 91 \u2013 Dr. Joshua Thurow on theories of the atonement<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-92-dr-joshua-thurow-on-objections-to-atonement-theories\/\" target=\"_blank\">podcast 92 \u2013 Dr. Joshua Thurow on objections to atonement theories<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-episode-37-why-did-jesus-have-to-suffer\/\" target=\"_blank\">podcast 37 \u2013 Why did Jesus have to suffer?<\/a><\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<\/li>\n<li><a href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-85-heretic-four-approaches-to-dropping-h-bombs\/\" target=\"_blank\">podcast 85 &#8211; Heretic! 4 approaches to dropping H-bombs<\/a><\/li>\n<li><strong>John Locke on what is essential to Christian belief<\/strong>\n<ul>\n<li><a href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-episode-52-john-lockes-the-reasonableness-of-christianity-part-1\/\" target=\"_blank\">podcast 52 \u2013 John Locke\u2019s The Reasonableness of Christianity, Part 1<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-episode-53-john-lockes-the-reasonableness-of-christianity-part-2\/\" target=\"_blank\">podcast 53 \u2013 John Locke\u2019s The Reasonableness of Christianity, Part 2<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-episode-54-john-edwards-vs-john-lockes-reasonableness-of-christianity\/\" target=\"_blank\">podcast 54 \u2013 John Edwards vs. John Locke\u2019s Reasonableness of Christianity<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-episode-55-john-lockes-second-vindication-of-his-reasonableness-of-christianity\/\" target=\"_blank\">podcast 55 \u2013 John Locke\u2019s Second Vindication of his Reasonableness of Christianity<\/a><\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<\/li>\n<li><strong><a href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/who-should-christians-worship\/\" target=\"_blank\">Who should Christians worship?<\/a><\/strong><\/li>\n<li><a href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/god-and-his-son-the-logic-of-the-new-testament\/\" target=\"_blank\">God and his Son: the logic of the New Testament<\/a><\/li>\n<li>This week&#8217;s thinking music has been \u201c<a href=\"http:\/\/freemusicarchive.org\/music\/The_Mind_Orchestra\/Devoured_by_the_Comfort_Zone\/03_-_The_Mind_Orchestra_-_Vibe_Merchant\" target=\"_blank\">Vibe Merchant<\/a>\u201d by <a href=\"http:\/\/freemusicarchive.org\/music\/The_Mind_Orchestra\/\" target=\"_blank\">The Mind Orchestra<\/a>. <object width=\"300\" height=\"50\"><param name=\"movie\" value=\"http:\/\/freemusicarchive.org\/swf\/trackplayer.swf\" \/><param name=\"flashvars\" value=\"track=http:\/\/freemusicarchive.org\/services\/playlists\/embed\/track\/115665.xml\" \/><param name=\"allowscriptaccess\" value=\"sameDomain\" \/><embed type=\"application\/x-shockwave-flash\" src=\"http:\/\/freemusicarchive.org\/swf\/trackplayer.swf\" width=\"300\" height=\"50\" flashvars=\"track=http:\/\/freemusicarchive.org\/services\/playlists\/embed\/track\/115665.xml\" allowscriptaccess=\"sameDomain\" \/><\/object><\/li>\n<\/ul>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Trinitarian theologies are a major barrier to Muslims accepting Christianity. In this episode we hear how Mr. Qureshi changed his view that the Trinity is a patently ridiculous doctrine.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":1,"featured_media":35605,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"neve_meta_sidebar":"","neve_meta_container":"","neve_meta_enable_content_width":"","neve_meta_content_width":0,"neve_meta_title_alignment":"","neve_meta_author_avatar":"","neve_post_elements_order":"","neve_meta_disable_header":"","neve_meta_disable_footer":"","neve_meta_disable_title":"","footnotes":""},"categories":[37,21,16,6,4,59,8,38,20,57,3,43],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-35603","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-apologetics","category-bible","category-books","category-complaints","category-heresy-orthodoxy","category-islam","category-linkage","category-monotheism","category-mystery","category-podcast","category-theories","category-unitarianism"],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/35603","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/1"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=35603"}],"version-history":[{"count":2,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/35603\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":37357,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/35603\/revisions\/37357"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/35605"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=35603"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=35603"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=35603"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}