{"id":38475,"date":"2017-02-20T12:22:58","date_gmt":"2017-02-20T17:22:58","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/?p=38475"},"modified":"2017-03-09T20:01:18","modified_gmt":"2017-03-10T01:01:18","slug":"podcast-172-the-creed-of-the-long-lines-344","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-172-the-creed-of-the-long-lines-344\/","title":{"rendered":"podcast 172 &#8211; The Creed of the Long Lines (344)"},"content":{"rendered":"<div class=\"powerpress_player\" id=\"powerpress_player_1183\"><audio class=\"wp-audio-shortcode\" id=\"audio-38475-1\" preload=\"none\" style=\"width: 100%;\" controls=\"controls\"><source type=\"audio\/mpeg\" src=\"http:\/\/media.blubrry.com\/trinities\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/podcast\/trinities172.mp3?_=1\" \/><a href=\"http:\/\/media.blubrry.com\/trinities\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/podcast\/trinities172.mp3\">http:\/\/media.blubrry.com\/trinities\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/podcast\/trinities172.mp3<\/a><\/audio><\/div><p class=\"powerpress_links powerpress_links_mp3\" style=\"margin-bottom: 1px !important;\">Podcast: <a href=\"http:\/\/media.blubrry.com\/trinities\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/podcast\/trinities172.mp3\" class=\"powerpress_link_pinw\" target=\"_blank\" title=\"Play in new window\" onclick=\"return powerpress_pinw('https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/?powerpress_pinw=38475-podcast');\" rel=\"nofollow\">Play in new window<\/a> | <a href=\"http:\/\/media.blubrry.com\/trinities\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/podcast\/trinities172.mp3\" class=\"powerpress_link_d\" title=\"Download\" rel=\"nofollow\" download=\"trinities172.mp3\">Download<\/a><\/p><p class=\"powerpress_links powerpress_subscribe_links\">Subscribe: <a href=\"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/7FuUF9DZM3zhtN41n6RJ6l\" class=\"powerpress_link_subscribe powerpress_link_subscribe_spotify\" target=\"_blank\" title=\"Subscribe on Spotify\" rel=\"nofollow\">Spotify<\/a> | <a href=\"https:\/\/subscribebyemail.com\/trinities.org\/blog\/feed\/podcast\/\" class=\"powerpress_link_subscribe powerpress_link_subscribe_email\" target=\"_blank\" title=\"Subscribe by Email\" rel=\"nofollow\">Email<\/a> | <a href=\"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/feed\/podcast\/\" class=\"powerpress_link_subscribe powerpress_link_subscribe_rss\" target=\"_blank\" title=\"Subscribe via RSS\" rel=\"nofollow\">RSS<\/a><\/p><p><a href=\"https:\/\/commons.wikimedia.org\/wiki\/File:Hans_Baldung_Grien_-_The_Trinity_and_Mystic_Piet%C3%A0_-_Google_Art_Project.jpg\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"alignright size-full wp-image-38477\" src=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/detail-of-Hans_Baldung_Grien_-_The_Trinity_and_Mystic_Piet\u00e0_-_Google_Art_Project.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"400\" height=\"503\" srcset=\"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/detail-of-Hans_Baldung_Grien_-_The_Trinity_and_Mystic_Piet\u00e0_-_Google_Art_Project.jpg 400w, https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/detail-of-Hans_Baldung_Grien_-_The_Trinity_and_Mystic_Piet\u00e0_-_Google_Art_Project-239x300.jpg 239w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 400px) 100vw, 400px\" \/><\/a>In 344 a meeting of Eastern bishops assembled at Antioch, and they decided to send a delegation to the west with a statement explaining their theology. What they sent was a rerun of <a href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-114-the-recycled-creed\/\">a creed from 342<\/a>, but with\u00a0<a href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-115-the-aborted-council-at-serdica-in-343\/\">additions from 343<\/a>, and their own <strong>lengthy explanations<\/strong> added to the end. These are most revealing. This creed is call &#8220;the <strong>Macrostich<\/strong>&#8221; or the Long-lined Creed or the Creed of the Long Lines. In this episode we find out why these bishops say that:<\/p>\n<ul>\n<li>Christ is <strong>&#8220;God&#8221; but not &#8220;true God&#8221;<\/strong><\/li>\n<li>the Son is <strong>generated<\/strong> by God&#8217;s choice or will, &#8220;apart from time&#8221;<\/li>\n<li>that Father, Son, and Spirit are a triad of <strong>three realities<\/strong><\/li>\n<li>the Son to be (ontologically and functionally) <strong>subordinate<\/strong> to the Father<\/li>\n<li>it is OK to describe the Son as (uniquely) &#8220;<strong>created<\/strong>&#8220;<\/li>\n<li>that the Father and the Son are<strong> not two gods<\/strong><\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<p>Avoiding as much controversial, non-biblical language as they thought they could, they hoped this creed would be acceptable all around, even to partisans of the 325 creed at Nicea. In this episode, you&#8217;ll hear a <strong>detailed analysis of their theology<\/strong>, and you&#8217;ll find out whether their <strong>hopes for unity<\/strong> were realized or dashed.[spp-tweet tweet=&#8221;A non-Arian statement of subordinationist theology, c. 344?&#8221;]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Links for this episode:<\/strong><a href=\"https:\/\/commons.wikimedia.org\/wiki\/File:Understanding-Reid-Highsmith.png\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"alignleft wp-image-38478\" src=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/Understanding-by-Reid-Highsmith.png\" alt=\"\" width=\"394\" height=\"400\" srcset=\"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/Understanding-by-Reid-Highsmith.png 473w, https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/Understanding-by-Reid-Highsmith-296x300.png 296w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 394px) 100vw, 394px\" \/><\/a><\/p>\n<ul id=\"lcp_instance_0\" class=\"lcp_catlist\">\n<li><a title=\"podcast 115 \u2013 the aborted council at Serdica in 343\" href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-115-the-aborted-council-at-serdica-in-343\/\">podcast 115 \u2013 the aborted council at Serdica in 343<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a title=\"podcast 114 \u2013 the recycled creed (342-359)\" href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-114-the-recycled-creed\/\">podcast 114 \u2013 the recycled creed (342-359)<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a title=\"podcast 113 \u2013 the council at Antioch in 341\" href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-113-the-council-at-antioch-in-341\/\">podcast 113 \u2013 the council at Antioch in 341<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a title=\"podcast 73 \u2013 Is Proverbs 8 about Jesus? Part 3\" href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-73-is-proverbs-8-about-jesus-part-3\/\">podcast 73 \u2013 Is Proverbs 8 about Jesus? Part 3<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a title=\"podcast 72 \u2013 Is Proverbs 8 about Jesus? Part 2\" href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-72-is-proverbs-8-about-jesus-part-2\/\">podcast 72 \u2013 Is Proverbs 8 about Jesus? Part 2<\/a><\/li>\n<li><strong><a title=\"podcast 71 \u2013 Is Proverbs 8 about Jesus? Part 1\" href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-71-proverbs-8-jesus-part-1\/\">podcast 71 \u2013 Is Proverbs 8 about Jesus? Part 1<\/a><\/strong><\/li>\n<li><a title=\"podcast 11 \u2013 Tertullian the unitarian\" href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-11-tertullian-the-unitarian\/\">podcast 11 \u2013 Tertullian the unitarian<\/a><\/li>\n<li>Athanasius, <a href=\"http:\/\/www.ccel.org\/ccel\/schaff\/npnf204.xxii.i.html\"><em>De Synodis<\/em><\/a><\/li>\n<li>R.P.C. Hanson, <em><a href=\"http:\/\/astore.amazon.com\/trinities-20\/detail\/080103146X\" target=\"_blank\">The Search for the Christian Doctrine of God<\/a><\/em><\/li>\n<li>\u00a0Proverbs 8; John 1; Philippians 2; John 20:28; John 17:1-3; 1 Corinthians 8:4-6; Acts 2:36.<\/li>\n<li>This week&#8217;s thinking music is &#8220;<a href=\"http:\/\/freemusicarchive.org\/music\/Andy_G_Cohen\/MUL__DIV_1198\/Andy_G_Cohen_-_MULDIV_-_04_-_A_Perceptible_Shift\">A Perceptible Shift<\/a>&#8221; by <a href=\"http:\/\/freemusicarchive.org\/music\/Andy_G_Cohen\/\">Andy G. Cohen<\/a>.<\/li>\n<\/ul>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>In 344 a meeting of Eastern bishops sent a statement to the West explaining their theology.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":1,"featured_media":38477,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"neve_meta_sidebar":"","neve_meta_container":"","neve_meta_enable_content_width":"","neve_meta_content_width":0,"neve_meta_title_alignment":"","neve_meta_author_avatar":"","neve_post_elements_order":"","neve_meta_disable_header":"","neve_meta_disable_footer":"","neve_meta_disable_title":"","footnotes":""},"categories":[21,15,58,4,14,38,57,13,43],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-38475","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-bible","category-christology","category-creeds","category-heresy-orthodoxy","category-history","category-monotheism","category-podcast","category-theologians","category-unitarianism"],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/38475","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/1"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=38475"}],"version-history":[{"count":5,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/38475\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":38625,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/38475\/revisions\/38625"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/38477"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=38475"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=38475"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=38475"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}