{"id":38968,"date":"2017-05-22T15:31:53","date_gmt":"2017-05-22T19:31:53","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/?p=38968"},"modified":"2017-05-22T15:31:53","modified_gmt":"2017-05-22T19:31:53","slug":"podcast-184-where-did-jesus-say-i-am-god-worship-me","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-184-where-did-jesus-say-i-am-god-worship-me\/","title":{"rendered":"podcast 184 &#8211; Where did Jesus say &#8220;I am God, worship me&#8221;?"},"content":{"rendered":"<div class=\"powerpress_player\" id=\"powerpress_player_2347\"><audio class=\"wp-audio-shortcode\" id=\"audio-38968-1\" preload=\"none\" style=\"width: 100%;\" controls=\"controls\"><source type=\"audio\/mpeg\" src=\"http:\/\/media.blubrry.com\/trinities\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/podcast\/trinities184.mp3?_=1\" \/><a href=\"http:\/\/media.blubrry.com\/trinities\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/podcast\/trinities184.mp3\">http:\/\/media.blubrry.com\/trinities\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/podcast\/trinities184.mp3<\/a><\/audio><\/div><p class=\"powerpress_links powerpress_links_mp3\" style=\"margin-bottom: 1px !important;\">Podcast: <a href=\"http:\/\/media.blubrry.com\/trinities\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/podcast\/trinities184.mp3\" class=\"powerpress_link_pinw\" target=\"_blank\" title=\"Play in new window\" onclick=\"return powerpress_pinw('https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/?powerpress_pinw=38968-podcast');\" rel=\"nofollow\">Play in new window<\/a> | <a href=\"http:\/\/media.blubrry.com\/trinities\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/podcast\/trinities184.mp3\" class=\"powerpress_link_d\" title=\"Download\" rel=\"nofollow\" download=\"trinities184.mp3\">Download<\/a><\/p><p class=\"powerpress_links powerpress_subscribe_links\">Subscribe: <a href=\"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/7FuUF9DZM3zhtN41n6RJ6l\" class=\"powerpress_link_subscribe powerpress_link_subscribe_spotify\" target=\"_blank\" title=\"Subscribe on Spotify\" rel=\"nofollow\">Spotify<\/a> | <a href=\"https:\/\/subscribebyemail.com\/trinities.org\/blog\/feed\/podcast\/\" class=\"powerpress_link_subscribe powerpress_link_subscribe_email\" target=\"_blank\" title=\"Subscribe by Email\" rel=\"nofollow\">Email<\/a> | <a href=\"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/feed\/podcast\/\" class=\"powerpress_link_subscribe powerpress_link_subscribe_rss\" target=\"_blank\" title=\"Subscribe via RSS\" rel=\"nofollow\">RSS<\/a><\/p><p><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"alignleft wp-image-38970\" src=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/Exegete-at-work-1-450x363.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"400\" height=\"323\" srcset=\"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/Exegete-at-work-1-450x363.jpg 450w, https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/Exegete-at-work-1-768x620.jpg 768w, https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/Exegete-at-work-1-1024x826.jpg 1024w, https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/Exegete-at-work-1.jpg 1192w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 400px) 100vw, 400px\" \/><strong>Muslims often ask<\/strong> this question, as their apologists and imams teach them to ask it. Of course, it&#8217;s a good question to ask!<\/p>\n<p>Evangelical apologist <strong>Dr. David Wood answers<\/strong> that while Jesus is never reported to <em>explicitly<\/em> say this, he clearly implies in many places that he is God himself.<\/p>\n<p>In this episode, I critique two presentations by Dr. Wood in which he argues that in many places, Jesus <em>implicitly<\/em> claims to be God.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Many of Dr. Wood&#8217;s arguments<\/strong> take this form:<\/p>\n<blockquote><p>1. Only God can\u00a0 X.<br \/>\n2. Jesus can X.<br \/>\n3. Therefore, Jesus = God.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p>This argument is valid (<em>if<\/em> 1-2 were true, <em>then<\/em> 3 would be too), but a glaring problem with it is the total lack of evidence for 1. Also, every such argument, there is a strong <strong>counterargument<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<blockquote><p>4. It is false that Jesus = God.<br \/>\n5. Jesus can X.<br \/>\n6. Therefore, it is false that only God can X.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p>Notice that the arguments agree in their second premises. But there is, for the Christian, <strong>rock-solid evidence for 4<\/strong> &#8211; that the NT teaches differences between Jesus and God, and it is self-evident that nothing can at one time differ from itself. This evidence for 4 <strong>outweighs the (non-existent) evidence for 1<\/strong>. Apologists like Dr. Wood <strong>merely assert<\/strong> 1, though it is neither self-evident nor supported by Christian scriptures. Also, in most cases there will be a scripture passage which implies the <strong>falsity of 1<\/strong>. Finally, because of his theory that Jesus just is God himself, Dr. Wood ignores that the passages he appeals to are plainly assuming the truth of 4 and the falsity of 3.<\/p>\n<p>What can X be? In the New Testament, we see <strong>Jesus: forgiving sins, being worshiped<\/strong>, saying that he&#8217;ll some day judge the world, and calling himself &#8220;the first and the last.&#8221; Is he thereby claiming to be God? And does the New Testament agree with the Islamic view that worshiping anyone alongside God would be <strong>the serious sin of <em>shirk<\/em><\/strong>, of associating another with the one God?<\/p>\n<p>Dr. Wood needs to either embrace the conclusion of<strong><a href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-124-a-challenge-to-jesus-is-god-apologists\/\"> the first stage of the Challenge argument<\/a><\/strong>, or explain which premise he denies and why:<\/p>\n<ol>\n<li>God and Jesus differ.<\/li>\n<li>Things which differ are two (i.e. are not numerically identical)<\/li>\n<li>Therefore,\u00a0<a href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/jesus-god-and-an-inconsistent-triad\/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">God and Jesus are two (not numerically identical).<\/a> (1, 2)<\/li>\n<\/ol>\n<p>[spp-tweet tweet=&#8221;Did Jesus say, &#8220;I am God, worship me&#8221;?&#8221;]<\/p>\n<p><strong>Links for this episode:<\/strong><\/p>\n<ul>\n<li><a title=\"podcast 183 \u2013 Challenge Unmet\" href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-183-challenge-unmet\/\">podcast 183 \u2013 Challenge Unmet<img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"alignright size-full wp-image-38981\" src=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/buttercup.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"347\" height=\"300\" \/><\/a><\/li>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/www.youtube.com\/watch?v=JNzX-ymG3f0\">Jesus: The Final Judge<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/www.youtube.com\/watch?v=sS-lLTfCI7c\">Where Did Jesus Say, &#8220;I Am God, Worship Me&#8221;? (David Wood) <\/a><\/li>\n<li><strong><a href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/who-should-christians-worship\/\">Who Should Christians Worship?<\/a><\/strong> (<a href=\"https:\/\/www.academia.edu\/23869279\/_Who_Should_Christians_Worship_Journal_of_Biblical_Unitarianism_1_1_5-33_2014\">paper<\/a>)<\/li>\n<li><a href=\"http:\/\/biblehub.com\/greek\/4352.htm\"><em>proskuneo<\/em><\/a><\/li>\n<li><a href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/larry-hurtado-on-early-christians-worship-of-jesus\/\">Larry Hurtado on early Christians\u2019 worship of Jesus<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a title=\"podcast 16 \u2013 How is Jesus \u201cthe one Lord\u201d?\" href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-16-how-is-jesus-the-one-lord\/\">podcast 16 \u2013 How is Jesus \u201cthe one Lord\u201d?<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a title=\"podcast 15 \u2013 Are Paul\u2019s \u201cone God\u201d and \u201cone Lord\u201d one and the same?\" href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-15-are-pauls-one-god-and-one-lord-one-and-the-same\/\">podcast 15 \u2013 Are Paul\u2019s \u201cone God\u201d and \u201cone Lord\u201d one and the same?<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a title=\"podcast 14 \u2013 One God, One Lord, Two Interpretations\" href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-14-one-god-one-lord-two-interpretations\/\">podcast 14 \u2013 One God, One Lord, Two Interpretations<\/a><\/li>\n<li><strong><a href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/god-and-his-son-the-logic-of-the-new-testament\/\">on the logical form of &#8220;Only God can ___.&#8221;<\/a><\/strong> (<a href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/god-and-his-son-the-logic-of-the-new-testament\/\">All three parts<\/a>.)<a title=\"podcast 62 \u2013 Dr. Dustin Smith on the preexistence of Jesus in the gospel of John\" href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-62-dr-dustin-smith-on-the-preexistence-of-jesus-in-the-gospel-of-john\/\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"alignright size-full wp-image-38987\" src=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/Jesus-raises-Lazarus.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"320\" height=\"446\" \/><\/a><\/li>\n<li><a href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-92-dr-joshua-thurow-on-objections-to-atonement-theories\/\">podcast 92 \u2013 Dr. Joshua Thurow on objections to atonement theories <\/a><\/li>\n<li><strong><a href=\"https:\/\/www.youtube.com\/watch?v=ryHKLdl--Gc\">John Shoenheit on John 8:58<\/a><\/strong><\/li>\n<li><a title=\"podcast 62 \u2013 Dr. Dustin Smith on the preexistence of Jesus in the gospel of John\" href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-62-dr-dustin-smith-on-the-preexistence-of-jesus-in-the-gospel-of-john\/\">podcast 62 \u2013 Dr. Dustin Smith on the preexistence of Jesus in the gospel of John<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a title=\"podcast 66 \u2013 Before Abraham was\u2026 what?\" href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-66-before-abraham-was-what\/\">podcast 66 \u2013 Before Abraham was\u2026 what?<\/a><\/li>\n<li>Psalm 9:7-8; Matthew 25:31-41; Daniel 7:9-14; John 5:22-23; Revelation 5:6-14; Philippians 2:9-11; Revelation 4:8-11; Mark 13:19; Mark 10:6; Isaiah 44:6; John 10:30-39; Revelation 1:17-18;\u00a0 Psalm 51:4; Mark 2:5-12;\u00a0 Matthew 9:8; Psalm 31:5; John 14:6;\u00a0 1 Samuel 2:6; John 5:25-29; John 11:24-27; Isaiah 42:8-9; John 17:1-5; Acts 2:21-42; Luke 9:28-36; John 5:23; Mark 2:28; Matthew 22:41-45; John 8:39-58; Matthew 12:6; John 5:21-23; Matthew 2:11; John 20:28; 1 Corinthians 8:6; John 20 thesis; John 20:17.<\/li>\n<li>This week&#8217;s thinking music is &#8220;<a href=\"http:\/\/freemusicarchive.org\/music\/Artofescapism\/Drama_King_Action_Orchestra\/Where_Are_Your_Friends\">Where Are Your Friends?<\/a>&#8221; by <a href=\"http:\/\/freemusicarchive.org\/music\/Artofescapism\/\">Artofescapism<\/a>.<\/li>\n<\/ul>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Did Jesus imply that he&#8217;s God himself?<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":1,"featured_media":38969,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"neve_meta_sidebar":"","neve_meta_container":"","neve_meta_enable_content_width":"","neve_meta_content_width":0,"neve_meta_title_alignment":"","neve_meta_author_avatar":"","neve_post_elements_order":"","neve_meta_disable_header":"","neve_meta_disable_footer":"","neve_meta_disable_title":"","footnotes":""},"categories":[37,21,15,6,59,57,43],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-38968","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-apologetics","category-bible","category-christology","category-complaints","category-islam","category-podcast","category-unitarianism"],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/38968","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/1"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=38968"}],"version-history":[{"count":5,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/38968\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":38989,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/38968\/revisions\/38989"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/38969"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=38968"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=38968"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=38968"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}