{"id":40384,"date":"2018-06-04T01:10:16","date_gmt":"2018-06-04T05:10:16","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/?p=40384"},"modified":"2018-06-11T23:48:26","modified_gmt":"2018-06-12T03:48:26","slug":"podcast-230-the-failure-of-fashionable-antiunitarian-arguments","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-230-the-failure-of-fashionable-antiunitarian-arguments\/","title":{"rendered":"podcast 230 &#8211; The Failure of Fashionable Antiunitarian Arguments"},"content":{"rendered":"<div class=\"powerpress_player\" id=\"powerpress_player_4870\"><audio class=\"wp-audio-shortcode\" id=\"audio-40384-1\" preload=\"none\" style=\"width: 100%;\" controls=\"controls\"><source type=\"audio\/mpeg\" src=\"http:\/\/media.blubrry.com\/trinities\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/podcast\/trinities230.mp3?_=1\" \/><a href=\"http:\/\/media.blubrry.com\/trinities\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/podcast\/trinities230.mp3\">http:\/\/media.blubrry.com\/trinities\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/podcast\/trinities230.mp3<\/a><\/audio><\/div><p class=\"powerpress_links powerpress_links_mp3\" style=\"margin-bottom: 1px !important;\">Podcast: <a href=\"http:\/\/media.blubrry.com\/trinities\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/podcast\/trinities230.mp3\" class=\"powerpress_link_pinw\" target=\"_blank\" title=\"Play in new window\" onclick=\"return powerpress_pinw('https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/?powerpress_pinw=40384-podcast');\" rel=\"nofollow\">Play in new window<\/a> | <a href=\"http:\/\/media.blubrry.com\/trinities\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/podcast\/trinities230.mp3\" class=\"powerpress_link_d\" title=\"Download\" rel=\"nofollow\" download=\"trinities230.mp3\">Download<\/a><\/p><p class=\"powerpress_links powerpress_subscribe_links\">Subscribe: <a href=\"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/7FuUF9DZM3zhtN41n6RJ6l\" class=\"powerpress_link_subscribe powerpress_link_subscribe_spotify\" target=\"_blank\" title=\"Subscribe on Spotify\" rel=\"nofollow\">Spotify<\/a> | <a href=\"https:\/\/subscribebyemail.com\/trinities.org\/blog\/feed\/podcast\/\" class=\"powerpress_link_subscribe powerpress_link_subscribe_email\" target=\"_blank\" title=\"Subscribe by Email\" rel=\"nofollow\">Email<\/a> | <a href=\"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/feed\/podcast\/\" class=\"powerpress_link_subscribe powerpress_link_subscribe_rss\" target=\"_blank\" title=\"Subscribe via RSS\" rel=\"nofollow\">RSS<\/a><\/p><p><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"wp-image-40386 size-medium alignright\" src=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/Impossible-450x300.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"450\" height=\"300\" srcset=\"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/Impossible-450x300.jpg 450w, https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/Impossible-768x512.jpg 768w, https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/Impossible-1024x683.jpg 1024w, https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/Impossible.jpg 1920w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 450px) 100vw, 450px\" \/><\/p>\n<p><strong>If God were only one Person would he fail to be &#8220;perfectly loving,&#8221;<\/strong> and so fail to be a perfect being, even though he&#8217;s\u00a0 <em>supposed<\/em> to be perfect?<\/p>\n<p>Some have recently wielded arguments like this <strong>to try to show that any unitarian theology, Christian, Jewish, or Islamic, collapses<\/strong> into incoherence, or at least is less plausible than a theology on which God &#8220;is&#8221; more than one Person.<\/p>\n<p>On the popular level, apologist and philosopher <strong>Dr. William Lane Craig<\/strong> has made this recent sort of antiunitarian argument in a book and online.<\/p>\n<p><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"alignleft wp-image-40388\" src=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/Swinburne-in-2016-369x450.png\" alt=\"\" width=\"254\" height=\"310\" srcset=\"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/Swinburne-in-2016-369x450.png 369w, https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/Swinburne-in-2016.png 659w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 254px) 100vw, 254px\" \/>But the main source of such arguments in scholarly literature has been the leading Christian philosopher <strong>Richard Swinburne<\/strong>, now retired from Oxford University. He finds these arguments as far back as <strong>Augustine<\/strong>.<\/p>\n<p>In this episode, you&#8217;ll hear <strong>my presentation at the southwestern meeting of the Evangelical Philosophical Society<\/strong>, in which I summarize and criticize these sort of arguments by Craig and Swinburne.<\/p>\n<p>I claim that Augustine simply doesn&#8217;t say what Swinburne attributes to him, and I think I show here that <strong>Craig&#8217;s version should not convince anyone<\/strong>, as it rests ultimately on an implausible and unsupported assertion.<\/p>\n<p>But in this talk I<em> don&#8217;t<\/em> fully get to the bottom of Swinburne&#8217;s thinking on this topic. In the Q &amp; A portion of my session, Swinburne himself weighs in with some responses. I&#8217;m still working on this topic, hoping to eventually have a publishable paper.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Links for this episode:<\/strong><\/p>\n<ul>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/www.reasonablefaith.org\/\"><strong>William Lane Craig<\/strong><\/a><a title=\"podcast 58 \u2013 We can\u2019t prove the Trinity by reason alone\" href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-58-we-cant-prove-the-trinity-by-reason-alone\/\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"alignright wp-image-40387\" src=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/William-Lane-Craig-365x450.png\" alt=\"\" width=\"291\" height=\"359\" srcset=\"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/William-Lane-Craig-365x450.png 365w, https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/William-Lane-Craig.png 657w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 291px) 100vw, 291px\" \/><\/a>\n<ul>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/www.amazon.com\/Philosophical-Foundations-Christian-Worldview-Moreland\/dp\/0830851879\/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&amp;qid=1528086681&amp;sr=8-2&amp;keywords=Philosophical+Foundations+for+a+Christian+Worldview\"><em>Philosophical Foundations for a Christian Worldview, Second Edition<\/em><\/a><\/li>\n<li><strong><a href=\"https:\/\/www.reasonablefaith.org\/writings\/scholarly-writings\/christian-doctrines\/a-formulation-and-defense-of-the-doctrine-of-the-trinity\/\">&#8220;A Formulation and Defense of the Doctrine of the Trinity&#8221;<\/a><\/strong><\/li>\n<li>&#8220;<a href=\"https:\/\/www.reasonablefaith.org\/writings\/question-answer\/love-and-justice-in-the-trinity\/\">#166 Love and Justice in the Trinity<\/a>&#8220;<\/li>\n<li>&#8220;<a href=\"https:\/\/www.reasonablefaith.org\/writings\/question-answer\/the-mind-boggling-trinity\/\">#509 The \u2018Mind-Boggling\u2019 Trinity<\/a>&#8220;<\/li>\n<li>&#8220;<a href=\"https:\/\/www.reasonablefaith.org\/media\/reasonable-faith-podcast\/is-god-needy-is-god-a-projection-are-gods-attributes-contradictory\/\">Is God Needy? Is God a Projection? Are God&#8217;s Attributes Contradictory?<\/a>&#8220;<\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<\/li>\n<li><strong><a href=\"http:\/\/users.ox.ac.uk\/~orie0087\/\">Richard Swinburne<\/a><\/strong>\n<ul>\n<li><em><a title=\"The Christian God by Richard Swinurne\" href=\"http:\/\/astore.amazon.com\/trinities-20\/detail\/0198235127\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">The Christian God<\/a>\u00a0<\/em>(<a title=\"The Christian God, by Richard Swinburne, kindle edition\" href=\"http:\/\/astore.amazon.com\/trinities-20\/detail\/B004BXAK16\">kindle<\/a>)<\/li>\n<li><em><a title=\"Is There a God? Second, revised edition, by Richard Swinburne\" href=\"http:\/\/astore.amazon.com\/trinities-20\/detail\/019958043X\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">Is There a God?, 2nd ed<\/a>. <\/em>(<a title=\"Is there a God? By Richard Swinburne, revised edition for kindle\" href=\"http:\/\/astore.amazon.com\/trinities-20\/detail\/B00DO8PM0S\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">kindle<\/a>)<\/li>\n<li><em><a title=\"Was Jesus God? by Richard Swinburne\" href=\"http:\/\/astore.amazon.com\/trinities-20\/detail\/0199580448\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">Was Jesus God?<\/a><\/em> (<a title=\"kindle edition of Was Jesus God?\" href=\"http:\/\/astore.amazon.com\/trinities-20\/detail\/B006NXGKU2\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">kindle<\/a>)<\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<\/li>\n<li><a title=\"podcast 58 \u2013 We can\u2019t prove the Trinity by reason alone\" href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-58-we-cant-prove-the-trinity-by-reason-alone\/\">podcast 58 \u2013 We can\u2019t prove the Trinity by reason alone<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a title=\"podcast 57 \u2013 Richard Swinburne on the Trinity\" href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-57-richard-swinburne-on-the-trinity\/\">podcast 57 \u2013 Richard Swinburne on the Trinity<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a title=\"podcast 56 \u2013 Richard Swinburne on his life and work\" href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-56-richard-swinburne-on-his-life-and-work\/\">podcast 56 \u2013 Richard Swinburne on his life and work<\/a><\/li>\n<li><strong>&#8220;<a href=\"http:\/\/www.trinities.org\/dale\/SinglePerfect.pdf\">On the Possibility of a Single Perfect Person<\/a>&#8220;<\/strong><\/li>\n<li><a title=\"podcast 58 \u2013 We can\u2019t prove the Trinity by reason alone\" href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-58-we-cant-prove-the-trinity-by-reason-alone\/\">Evangelical Philosophical Society<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/swbts.edu\/academics\/campuses\/houston\/\">Southwestern Baptist Theological Seminary \u2013 Houston Campus<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/www.hbu.edu\/contact\/joshua-farris\/\">Joshua Farris<\/a><\/li>\n<li>This week&#8217;s thinking music is &#8220;<a href=\"http:\/\/freemusicarchive.org\/music\/Jesse_Spillane\/The_Laundry_Cycle\/Jesse_Spillane_-_The_Laundry_Cycle_-_02_Hot_Drop_Potato\">Hot Drop Potato<\/a>&#8221; by <a href=\"http:\/\/freemusicarchive.org\/music\/Jesse_Spillane\/\">Jesse Spillane<\/a>.<\/li>\n<\/ul>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Would a God who is a single Person fail to be perfect?<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":1,"featured_media":40386,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"neve_meta_sidebar":"","neve_meta_container":"","neve_meta_enable_content_width":"","neve_meta_content_width":0,"neve_meta_title_alignment":"","neve_meta_author_avatar":"","neve_post_elements_order":"","neve_meta_disable_header":"","neve_meta_disable_footer":"","neve_meta_disable_title":"","footnotes":""},"categories":[37,75,47,9,57,43],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-40384","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-apologetics","category-divine-attributes","category-papers","category-philosophy","category-podcast","category-unitarianism"],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/40384","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/1"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=40384"}],"version-history":[{"count":5,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/40384\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":40420,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/40384\/revisions\/40420"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/40386"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=40384"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=40384"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=40384"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}