{"id":40618,"date":"2018-10-01T15:02:25","date_gmt":"2018-10-01T19:02:25","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/?p=40618"},"modified":"2018-10-01T15:04:46","modified_gmt":"2018-10-01T19:04:46","slug":"podcast-239-dr-beau-branson-on-the-monarchy-of-the-father-part-1","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-239-dr-beau-branson-on-the-monarchy-of-the-father-part-1\/","title":{"rendered":"podcast 239 &#8211; Dr. Beau Branson on the Monarchy of the Father &#8211; Part 1"},"content":{"rendered":"<div class=\"powerpress_player\" id=\"powerpress_player_9704\"><audio class=\"wp-audio-shortcode\" id=\"audio-40618-1\" preload=\"none\" style=\"width: 100%;\" controls=\"controls\"><source type=\"audio\/mpeg\" src=\"http:\/\/media.blubrry.com\/trinities\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/podcast\/trinities239.mp3?_=1\" \/><a href=\"http:\/\/media.blubrry.com\/trinities\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/podcast\/trinities239.mp3\">http:\/\/media.blubrry.com\/trinities\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/podcast\/trinities239.mp3<\/a><\/audio><\/div><p class=\"powerpress_links powerpress_links_mp3\" style=\"margin-bottom: 1px !important;\">Podcast: <a href=\"http:\/\/media.blubrry.com\/trinities\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/podcast\/trinities239.mp3\" class=\"powerpress_link_pinw\" target=\"_blank\" title=\"Play in new window\" onclick=\"return powerpress_pinw('https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/?powerpress_pinw=40618-podcast');\" rel=\"nofollow\">Play in new window<\/a> | <a href=\"http:\/\/media.blubrry.com\/trinities\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/podcast\/trinities239.mp3\" class=\"powerpress_link_d\" title=\"Download\" rel=\"nofollow\" download=\"trinities239.mp3\">Download<\/a><\/p><p class=\"powerpress_links powerpress_subscribe_links\">Subscribe: <a href=\"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/7FuUF9DZM3zhtN41n6RJ6l\" class=\"powerpress_link_subscribe powerpress_link_subscribe_spotify\" target=\"_blank\" title=\"Subscribe on Spotify\" rel=\"nofollow\">Spotify<\/a> | <a href=\"https:\/\/subscribebyemail.com\/trinities.org\/blog\/feed\/podcast\/\" class=\"powerpress_link_subscribe powerpress_link_subscribe_email\" target=\"_blank\" title=\"Subscribe by Email\" rel=\"nofollow\">Email<\/a> | <a href=\"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/feed\/podcast\/\" class=\"powerpress_link_subscribe powerpress_link_subscribe_rss\" target=\"_blank\" title=\"Subscribe via RSS\" rel=\"nofollow\">RSS<\/a><\/p><p><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"alignleft size-medium wp-image-40621\" src=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/moscow-183661_1280-450x281.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"450\" height=\"281\" srcset=\"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/moscow-183661_1280-450x281.jpg 450w, https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/moscow-183661_1280-768x479.jpg 768w, https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/moscow-183661_1280-1024x639.jpg 1024w, https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/moscow-183661_1280.jpg 1280w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 450px) 100vw, 450px\" \/>According to Orthodox analytic theologian <strong>Dr. Beau Branson<\/strong> the right way to understand the Trinity is that the one true God is none other than the Father, although there are three divine persons. There is no triune God, no tripersonal God. In his view, this is the Eastern Orthodox understanding of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.<\/p>\n<p>In this first portion of his presentation &#8220;<a href=\"https:\/\/www.beaubranson.com\/research\/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\"><strong>One God, the Father: The Neglected Monarchy of Father and the Analytic Debate about the Trinity<\/strong>&#8220;<\/a> he disputes my <strong>definitions<\/strong> of what &#8220;trinitarian&#8221; and &#8220;unitarian&#8221; theologies are. Dr. Branson&#8217;s definitions are:<\/p>\n<p><em>(TB) A <strong>Trinitarian<\/strong> Theology says that:<\/em><br \/>\n<em>(1) There are exactly three divine \u201cpersons\u201d or individuals. Nevertheless,<\/em><br \/>\n<em>(2) There is exactly one God.<\/em><\/p>\n<p><em>(So, the persons can\u2019t all = the One God).<\/em><br \/>\n<em>(Presumably each one bears some important relation to the one God or has a \u201cclaim\u201d to being called \u201cGod,\u201d but our definition won\u2019t settle how that works.)<\/em><\/p>\n<p><em>(UB) A <strong>Unitarian<\/strong> Theology says that:<\/em><br \/>\n<em>(1) There is exactly one divine \u201cperson\u201d or individual, and<\/em><br \/>\n<em>(2) There is exactly one God.<\/em><\/p>\n<p><em>(Presumably these will just be identical, or at least \u201cnumerically one,\u201d but again we won\u2019t rule on that point in our definition.)<\/em><\/p>\n<p>In contrast, in &#8220;<a href=\"https:\/\/webapp.uibk.ac.at\/ojs2\/index.php\/EJPR\/article\/view\/1693\">Tertullian the unitarian<\/a>,&#8221; I say,<\/p>\n<p><em>A\u00a0\u2018<strong>trinitarian<\/strong>\u2019 Christian theology says that (1) there is one God (2) which or who in some sense contains or consists of three \u2018persons\u2019, namely, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, (3) who are equally divine, and (4) (1)-(3) are eternally the case.<\/em><\/p>\n<p><em>In contrast, a\u00a0 \u2018<strong>unitarian<\/strong>\u2019 Christian theology asserts that the (1) there is one God, (2) who is numerically identical with the one Jesus called \u2018Father\u2019, (3) and is not numerically identical with anyone else, (4) and (1)-(3) are eternally the case.<\/em><\/p>\n<p>Dr. Branson also explains what he calls the doctrine of <strong>the monarchy of the Father<\/strong>, which in his view, is a key to correctly understanding the Trinity. He also explain what he calls &#8220;<strong>egalitarian<\/strong>&#8221; or &#8220;symmetrical&#8221; views on the Trinity, which he contrasts with &#8220;<strong>monarchical<\/strong>&#8221; views.<\/p>\n<p>He has some interesting criticisms of my work on Trinity theories, and in his view, my work is not properly grounded in the historical sources, especially neglecting the Cappadocian Fathers and later Orthodox writers.<\/p>\n<p><strong>Do you accept his definitions or mine or neither, and why?<\/strong><\/p>\n<p><strong>Links for this episode:<\/strong><\/p>\n<ul>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/www.beaubranson.com\/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">Dr. Branson&#8217;s homepage<img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"alignright wp-image-40629\" src=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/gregory_of_nyssa.jpg\" alt=\"\" width=\"410\" height=\"465\" srcset=\"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/gregory_of_nyssa.jpg 495w, https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/gregory_of_nyssa-396x450.jpg 396w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 410px) 100vw, 410px\" \/><\/a><\/li>\n<li>preprint of &#8220;<a href=\"https:\/\/www.beaubranson.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2018\/03\/Penultimate-Draft-Branson-Historicity_in_Analytic_Theology.pdf\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">Ahistoricity in Analytic Theology<\/a>&#8220;<\/li>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/www.beaubranson.com\/research\/\">Dr. Branson&#8217;s slides with the unedited audio are posted here<\/a> (today&#8217;s episode covers his Part 1 and the first portion of his Part 2).<\/li>\n<li>&#8220;<a href=\"https:\/\/plato.stanford.edu\/entries\/trinity\/\">Trinity<\/a>&#8220;<\/li>\n<li><a href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-189-the-unfinished-business-of-the-reformation\/\">podcast 189 \u2013 The unfinished business of the Reformation<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a title=\"podcast 238 \u2013 Dialogue with a Catholic Listener\" href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-238-dialogue-with-a-catholic-listener\/\">podcast 238 \u2013 Dialogue with a Catholic Listener<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a title=\"podcast 11 \u2013 Tertullian the unitarian\" href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-11-tertullian-the-unitarian\/\">podcast 11 \u2013 Tertullian the unitarian<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a title=\"podcast 28 \u2013 Interview with Dr. William Hasker about his Metaphysics and the Tripersonal God \u2013 Part 2\" href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-28-interview-with-dr-william-hasker-about-his-metaphysics-and-the-tripersonal-god-part-2\/\">podcast 28 \u2013 Interview with Dr. William Hasker about his Metaphysics and the Tripersonal God \u2013 Part 2<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a title=\"podcast 27 \u2013 Interview with Dr. William Hasker about his Metaphysics and the Tripersonal God \u2013 Part 1\" href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-27-interview-with-dr-william-hasker-about-his-metaphysics-and-the-tripersonal-god-part-1\/\">podcast 27 \u2013 Interview with Dr. William Hasker about his Metaphysics and the Tripersonal God \u2013 Part 1<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/orthodoxwiki.org\/John_(Zizioulas)_of_Pergamon\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">John Zizioulas<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/www.svots.edu\/profile\/very-rev-dr-john-behr\">Dr. John Behr<\/a> (<a href=\"https:\/\/ishmaelite.blogspot.com\/2010\/06\/fr-john-behr-on-trinity.html\">on the Father as the one God<\/a>)<\/li>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/www.svots.edu\/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">St. Vladimir&#8217;s Orthodox Theological Seminary<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a href=\"https:\/\/articulifidei.blogspot.com\/\">Articuli Fidei<\/a><\/li>\n<li>This week&#8217;s thinking music is <a href=\"https:\/\/archive.org\/details\/Chants_of_the_Russian_Orthodox_Church2\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">&#8220;Thy Resurrection&#8221; from Chants of the Russian Orthodox Church 2<\/a>.<\/li>\n<\/ul>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Can one be a trinitarian without believing in a tripersonal God?<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":1,"featured_media":40621,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"neve_meta_sidebar":"","neve_meta_container":"","neve_meta_enable_content_width":"","neve_meta_content_width":0,"neve_meta_title_alignment":"","neve_meta_author_avatar":"","neve_post_elements_order":"","neve_meta_disable_header":"","neve_meta_disable_footer":"","neve_meta_disable_title":"","footnotes":""},"categories":[21,16,88,4,14,38,47,9,57,77,76,13,3,43],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-40618","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-bible","category-books","category-eastern-orthodoxy","category-heresy-orthodoxy","category-history","category-monotheism","category-papers","category-philosophy","category-podcast","category-protestant","category-roman-catholicism","category-theologians","category-theories","category-unitarianism"],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/40618","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/1"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=40618"}],"version-history":[{"count":5,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/40618\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":40635,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/40618\/revisions\/40635"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/40621"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=40618"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=40618"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=40618"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}