{"id":666,"date":"2009-01-21T17:16:39","date_gmt":"2009-01-21T21:16:39","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/?p=666"},"modified":"2015-03-06T21:57:43","modified_gmt":"2015-03-07T02:57:43","slug":"a-quote-every-theology-student-working-on-the-trinity-or-incarnation-should-memorize","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/a-quote-every-theology-student-working-on-the-trinity-or-incarnation-should-memorize\/","title":{"rendered":"a quote every theology student working on the Trinity or Incarnation should memorize"},"content":{"rendered":"<p><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\" size-full wp-image-667 alignright\" title=\"no-bologna\" src=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/no-bologna.jpg\" alt=\"no-bologna\" width=\"280\" height=\"280\" srcset=\"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/no-bologna.jpg 280w, https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/no-bologna-150x150.jpg 150w, https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/no-bologna-90x90.jpg 90w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 280px) 100vw, 280px\" \/><\/p>\n<p>Respected Catholic philosopher<a title=\"Freddoso's home page\" href=\"http:\/\/www.nd.edu\/~afreddos\/\" target=\"_blank\"> Alfred J. <strong>Freddoso<\/strong><\/a><strong> corrects some pervasive baloney about persons<\/strong> which theologians are still repeating, these 22 years later! The asterisk marks his footnote &#8211; this whole passage is an aside in a very rich paper of his. Out of politeness, I omit the author of the wrongheaded passage, and I&#8217;ve added some bold highlighting to the whole thing. We&#8217;ve been over<a title=\"Are persons essentially relational?\" href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/archives\/249\" target=\"_blank\"> some of this before<\/a>, but I think Freddoso puts it all very, very well.<\/p>\n<blockquote><p>&#8230;the many contemporary philosophers who accept <strong>a basically Aristotelian (as opposed to, say, Lockean or Humean) account of substance<\/strong> will have little difficulty with the metaphysical analysis of a person as a suppositum [ultimate subject of properties] with an intellectual nature [with essential powers of freely willing and knowing]. In fact, such philosophers are likely to be bemused by the assertion, sometimes heard issuing from the mouths of modern theologians,<strong> that the medieval notion of a person has been preempted or superceded in &#8220;modern thought&#8221;<\/strong>.<\/p>\n<p>* One can only conclude that those who make assertions like this have a disappointingly superficial and unduly selective acquaintance with the voluminous recent philosophical literature on substance, personhood and identity. The medieval conception of a person has not, to the best of my knowledge, been discredited in modern thought. To the contrary, I, like a number of other philosophers &#8211; including many who care not a whit about theology &#8211; believe it to be essentially correct&#8230;<\/p>\n<p>*[Freddoso&#8217;s footnote:] The following passage is not atypical:<\/p>\n<p>&#8220;&#8230;nothing can be done to conceal the real <strong>shift between the ancient and the modern concept of &#8216;person&#8217;<\/strong>. Classical theology spoke of a rational being existing in its own right. It failed to express interpersonal relations in its account&#8230; Modern thought latches onto self-awareness, freedom, and &#8211; in a particular way &#8211; intersubjectivity as key characteristics of personhood. We become persons in dealing with other persons, sharing a common language and experiencing a common history.<strong> Human persons exist only in the plural<\/strong>. We repeat the traditional word (&#8216;person&#8217;) at our peril. It has changed its meaning. &#8230;&#8221; [author omitted]<\/p>\n<p>Such talk may simply reflect<strong> a harmless misunderstanding<\/strong>, since the medieval account clearly entails that persons have natures intrinsically disposed towards self-awareness, free action and interpersonal relations. Or perhaps the writer is innocently confusing a<strong> metaphysical analysis<\/strong> of personhood with a <strong>psychological account<\/strong> of paradigmatic personhood or personal flourishing. However, the implications are a bit more disturbing if we take statements like the above as serious attempts to state sober metaphysical truths. Is the writer claiming, for instance, that self-awareness and the power to act freely and engage in meaningful intersubjective relationships are metaphysically <strong>necessary conditions<\/strong> for being a person? If so, this bit of news will not be welcomed by those many human beings who happen to be mentally retarded, insane, senile, comatose, or, for that matter, sound sleepers &#8211; not to mention, more poignantly in view of the fact that the author is a Catholic priest, fetuses and newly born infants. Again, in claiming that &#8220;we become persons in dealing with other persons,&#8221; does the author really intend to propose the metaphysical thesis that one and the same individual can in the normal course of of things first be a non-person and then be a person? Of course, if the assertion that human persons exist only in the plural is meant to express a metaphysical necessity, it will at least have the virtue of bringing<strong> comfort to anyone beset by an inordinate fear of being the sole survivor of a nuclear holocaust<\/strong>. But such an assertion is itself unlikely to survive the devastation wrought by careful philosophical scrutiny.<\/p>\n<p>&#8211; Alfed J. Freddoso, &#8220;Human Nature, Potency and the Incarnation,&#8221; <em>Faith &amp; Philosophy<\/em> 3:1 January 1986, pp. 29, 49-50.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p>To our theologian friends: yes, very many philosophers, and in particular Christian ones, accept a broadly Aristotelian account of persons &#8211; that persons are fundamental things which persist through time and change, and have essential and non-essential properties. There are of course rival views, and Hume does have a few fans out there. A couple of <strong>good (and free) places to start<\/strong>, in getting your head around what recent philosophers have argued about persons, would be <a title=\"Personal Identity\" href=\"http:\/\/plato.stanford.edu\/entries\/identity-personal\/\" target=\"_blank\">Personal Identity<\/a> in the <em>Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy<\/em> and<a title=\"Dualism and Mind\" href=\"http:\/\/www.iep.utm.edu\/d\/dualism.htm\" target=\"_blank\"> Dualism and Mind<\/a> in the <em>Internet Encyclopedia of Philosophy<\/em>.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Respected Catholic philosopher Alfred J. Freddoso corrects some pervasive baloney about persons which theologians are still repeating, these 22 years later! The asterisk marks his footnote &#8211; this whole passage is an aside in a very rich paper of his. Out of politeness, I omit the author of the wrongheaded passage, and I&#8217;ve added some&hellip;&nbsp;<a href=\"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/a-quote-every-theology-student-working-on-the-trinity-or-incarnation-should-memorize\/\" rel=\"bookmark\">Read More &raquo;<span class=\"screen-reader-text\">a quote every theology student working on the Trinity or Incarnation should memorize<\/span><\/a><\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":1,"featured_media":667,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"neve_meta_sidebar":"","neve_meta_container":"","neve_meta_enable_content_width":"","neve_meta_content_width":0,"neve_meta_title_alignment":"","neve_meta_author_avatar":"","neve_post_elements_order":"","neve_meta_disable_header":"","neve_meta_disable_footer":"","neve_meta_disable_title":"","footnotes":""},"categories":[6,14,33,9,7,13],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-666","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-complaints","category-history","category-incarnation","category-philosophy","category-quotes","category-theologians"],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/666","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/1"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=666"}],"version-history":[{"count":1,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/666\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":35015,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/666\/revisions\/35015"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/667"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=666"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=666"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=666"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}