{"id":6909,"date":"2014-12-15T15:44:52","date_gmt":"2014-12-15T20:44:52","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/?p=6909"},"modified":"2016-03-22T21:14:16","modified_gmt":"2016-03-23T01:14:16","slug":"podcast-66-before-abraham-was-what","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-66-before-abraham-was-what\/","title":{"rendered":"podcast 66 &#8211; Before Abraham was&#8230; what?"},"content":{"rendered":"<div class=\"powerpress_player\" id=\"powerpress_player_7861\"><audio class=\"wp-audio-shortcode\" id=\"audio-6909-1\" preload=\"none\" style=\"width: 100%;\" controls=\"controls\"><source type=\"audio\/mpeg\" src=\"http:\/\/media.blubrry.com\/trinities\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/podcast\/trinities066.mp3?_=1\" \/><a href=\"http:\/\/media.blubrry.com\/trinities\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/podcast\/trinities066.mp3\">http:\/\/media.blubrry.com\/trinities\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/podcast\/trinities066.mp3<\/a><\/audio><\/div><p class=\"powerpress_links powerpress_links_mp3\" style=\"margin-bottom: 1px !important;\">Podcast: <a href=\"http:\/\/media.blubrry.com\/trinities\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/podcast\/trinities066.mp3\" class=\"powerpress_link_pinw\" target=\"_blank\" title=\"Play in new window\" onclick=\"return powerpress_pinw('https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/?powerpress_pinw=6909-podcast');\" rel=\"nofollow\">Play in new window<\/a> | <a href=\"http:\/\/media.blubrry.com\/trinities\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/podcast\/trinities066.mp3\" class=\"powerpress_link_d\" title=\"Download\" rel=\"nofollow\" download=\"trinities066.mp3\">Download<\/a><\/p><p class=\"powerpress_links powerpress_subscribe_links\">Subscribe: <a href=\"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/show\/7FuUF9DZM3zhtN41n6RJ6l\" class=\"powerpress_link_subscribe powerpress_link_subscribe_spotify\" target=\"_blank\" title=\"Subscribe on Spotify\" rel=\"nofollow\">Spotify<\/a> | <a href=\"https:\/\/subscribebyemail.com\/trinities.org\/blog\/feed\/podcast\/\" class=\"powerpress_link_subscribe powerpress_link_subscribe_email\" target=\"_blank\" title=\"Subscribe by Email\" rel=\"nofollow\">Email<\/a> | <a href=\"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/feed\/podcast\/\" class=\"powerpress_link_subscribe powerpress_link_subscribe_rss\" target=\"_blank\" title=\"Subscribe via RSS\" rel=\"nofollow\">RSS<\/a><\/p><p><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"alignleft wp-image-6910 size-full\" src=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/Augistine-Bishop-of-Hippo-Regius.jpg\" alt=\"Augustine, Bishop of Hippo Regius\" width=\"255\" height=\"317\" srcset=\"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/Augistine-Bishop-of-Hippo-Regius.jpg 255w, https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/Augistine-Bishop-of-Hippo-Regius-241x300.jpg 241w, https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/Augistine-Bishop-of-Hippo-Regius-90x112.jpg 90w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 255px) 100vw, 255px\" \/><strong><a title=\"John 8:58\" href=\"http:\/\/biblehub.com\/john\/8-58.htm\" target=\"_blank\">&#8220;Before Abraham, I am.&#8221;<\/a>\u00a0<\/strong>What did Jesus, or the author of the fourth gospel, mean here?<\/p>\n<p>In <a title=\"trinities podcast episode 66\" href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-content\/podcast\/trinities%20066%20-%20Before%20Abraham%20was%20what.mp3\" target=\"_blank\">this episode<\/a> we hear how some<strong> ancient authors<\/strong>\u00a0interpreted John 8:58, including the famous North African bishop Augustine of Hippo, pictured here.<\/p>\n<p>In particular, is Jesus supposed to be saying,<\/p>\n<ul>\n<li>I am <strong>God<\/strong> himself.<\/li>\n<li>I <strong>have an attribute<\/strong> which implies being God himself, namely ___.<\/li>\n<li>I <strong>existed long before<\/strong> I was a human, even before Abraham.<\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<p>Or was the point, as was <a title=\"previous episodes on John 8:58\" href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/?s=john+8%3A58\" target=\"_blank\">argued in previous episodes<\/a>, that even before Abraham Jesus<strong> was the Messiah<\/strong>, that is, in God&#8217;s plan?<\/p>\n<p>Which reading best fits the text?<\/p>\n<p>You can also <strong>listen t<\/strong><strong>o this episode on<\/strong>\u00a0<strong><a title=\"trinities podcast @ stitcher\" href=\"http:\/\/www.stitcher.com\/s?fid=54067&amp;refid=stpr\" target=\"_blank\">Stitcher<\/a><\/strong>\u00a0or\u00a0<strong><a title=\"trinities @ itunes\" href=\"https:\/\/itunes.apple.com\/us\/podcast\/id690304581?mt=2&amp;uo=4&amp;at=11l5XS\" target=\"_blank\">iTunes<\/a>\u00a0(please subscribe, rate, and review<\/strong>\u00a0us in either or both \u2013 <strong><a title=\"how to rate us at iTunes and Stitcher\" href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/review\/\" target=\"_blank\">directions here<\/a><\/strong>). It is also available on\u00a0<a title=\"trinities podcast youtube playlist\" href=\"https:\/\/www.youtube.com\/watch?v=7s6ewXK-61A\" target=\"_blank\">YouTube<\/a> (you can\u00a0<a title=\"youtube subscription link\" href=\"http:\/\/www.youtube.com\/user\/khanpadawan?sub_confirmation=1\" target=\"_blank\">subscribe here<\/a>). If you would like to\u00a0<strong>upload audio feedback<\/strong> for possible inclusion in a future episode of this podcast,\u00a0<a title=\"upload audio feedback for the trinities podcast here\" href=\"http:\/\/www.mediafire.com\/filedrop\/filedrop_hosted.php?drop=96df5ea43b9b7c6582cb95b8c5a7259d7cd8109e0cd009d4a5ecd099cc7e64fb\" target=\"_blank\">put the audio file here<\/a>.<\/p>\n<p>You can <strong>support the trinities podcast by ordering anything through Amazon.com<\/strong> after <a href=\"http:\/\/www.amazon.com\/ref=assoc_res_sw_logo?tag=trinitiesorg-20&amp;linkCode=w14&amp;linkID=ISZSX35I27NLT3KG\" target=\"_blank\">clicking through one of our links<\/a>. We get a small % of your purchase, even though your price is not increased. (If you see \u201ctrinities\u201d in you\u00a0url while at Amazon, then we\u2019ll get it.)<\/p>\n<p><strong>Links for this episode<\/strong>:<\/p>\n<ul>\n<li>recent trinities podcast episodes on John 8:58 and related texts\n<ul>\n<li><a title=\"trinities podcast episode 61\" href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-61-dr-dustin-smith-on-preexistence-in-ancient-jewish-thought\/\" target=\"_blank\">61 &#8211; Dr. Smith on preexistence<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a title=\"trinities podcast episode 62\" href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-62-dr-dustin-smith-on-the-preexistence-of-jesus-in-the-gospel-of-john\/\" target=\"_blank\">62 &#8211; Dr. Smith on preexistence in John<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a title=\"trinities podcast episode 63\" href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-63-thomas-belsham-and-other-scholars-on-john-858\/\" target=\"_blank\">63 &#8211; Belsham and others on John 8:58<\/a><\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<\/li>\n<li><a title=\"Novatian at Wikipedia\" href=\"https:\/\/en.wikipedia.org\/wiki\/Novatian\" target=\"_blank\">Novatian<\/a>\n<ul>\n<li><a title=\"Novatian's On the Trinity\" href=\"http:\/\/www.newadvent.org\/fathers\/0511.htm\" target=\"_blank\"><em>On the Trinity<\/em><\/a><\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<\/li>\n<li><a title=\"Pseudo-Matthew gospel\" href=\"http:\/\/www.gnosis.org\/library\/psudomat.htm\" target=\"_blank\"><em>The Gospel of Pseudo-Matthew<\/em>, aka <em>The Book About the Origin of the Blessed Mary and the Childhood of the Savior<\/em><\/a><\/li>\n<li><a title=\"John Chrysostom at Christianity Today magazine\" href=\"http:\/\/www.christianitytoday.com\/ch\/131christians\/pastorsandpreachers\/chrysostom.html\" target=\"_blank\">John Chrysostom<\/a>\n<ul>\n<li><a title=\"Homily 55, St. John Chrysostom\" href=\"http:\/\/www.ccel.org\/ccel\/schaff\/npnf114.iv.lvii.html\" target=\"_blank\">\u00a0Homily 55<\/a><\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<\/li>\n<li><a title=\"Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy\" href=\"http:\/\/plato.stanford.edu\/entries\/augustine\/\" target=\"_blank\">Augustine of Hippo<\/a>\n<ul>\n<li><a title=\"Augustine, Homily 2 - comments on 1 John\" href=\"%20http:\/\/www.ccel.org\/ccel\/schaff\/npnf107.iv.v.html\" target=\"_blank\">Homily 2<\/a><\/li>\n<li><a title=\"Augustine of Hippo, Tractate 43\" href=\"http:\/\/www.ccel.org\/ccel\/schaff\/npnf107.iii.xliv.html\" target=\"_blank\">Tractate 43<\/a><\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<\/li>\n<li><a title=\"trinities 030 The Council of Nicea\" href=\"http:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/podcast-30-the-council-of-nicea\/\" target=\"_blank\">podcast 30 &#8211; The Council of Nicea<\/a><\/li>\n<li>Patrick Navas, <a title=\"Divine Truth or Human Tradition, by Patrick Navas\" href=\"http:\/\/astore.amazon.com\/trinities-20\/detail\/1463415214\" target=\"_blank\"><em>Divine\u00a0Truth or Human Tradition<\/em><\/a><\/li>\n<li>Craig Blomberg, <a title=\"Craig Blomberg, The Historical Reliability of the Gospels\" href=\"http:\/\/astore.amazon.com\/trinities-20\/detail\/0830828079\" target=\"_blank\"><em>The Historical Reliability of the Gospels<\/em><\/a><\/li>\n<li><a title=\"Luke 4, from the Jesus Movie\" href=\"http:\/\/youtu.be\/5pGEv9qXVaY?t=20m10s\" target=\"_blank\">Jesus narrowly avoids being thrown off a cliff in Nazareth, from Luke 4<\/a><\/li>\n<\/ul>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>\u201cBefore Abraham, I am.\u201d What did Jesus, or the author of the fourth gospel, mean here? In this episode we hear how some ancient authors interpreted John 8:58, including the famous North African bishop Augustine of Hippo.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":1,"featured_media":6910,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"neve_meta_sidebar":"","neve_meta_container":"","neve_meta_enable_content_width":"","neve_meta_content_width":0,"neve_meta_title_alignment":"","neve_meta_author_avatar":"","neve_post_elements_order":"","neve_meta_disable_header":"","neve_meta_disable_footer":"","neve_meta_disable_title":"","footnotes":""},"categories":[37,61,21,15,58,4,33,57,7,3,43],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-6909","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-apologetics","category-atonement","category-bible","category-christology","category-creeds","category-heresy-orthodoxy","category-incarnation","category-podcast","category-quotes","category-theories","category-unitarianism"],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/6909","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/1"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=6909"}],"version-history":[{"count":2,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/6909\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":37392,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/6909\/revisions\/37392"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/6910"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=6909"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=6909"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/trinities.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=6909"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}